Tricks of the Mac Game Programming Gurus/TricksOfTheMacGameProgrammingGurus.iso/Information/CSMP Digest/volume 1/csmp-v1-137.txt

Text File | 1994-12-08 | 42.8 KB | 969 lines | [TEXT/R*ch]

C.S.M.P. Digest             Sat, 11 Jul 92       Volume 1 : Issue 137

Today's Topics:

    Multi-channel synchronized sound
    Pricing of Mac vs Windows development environments
    Space/CheckMark in scroll area
    Is This PostScript ?!
    TCL and Apple Events & aevt rsrc format
    asynchronous XCMDs?
    cmarker for think C 5.0



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-------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Waikato University)
Subject: Multi-channel synchronized sound
Date: 9 Jun 92 13:45:24 +1200
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

I've been doing a bit of investigation into the problem of playing multiple
simultaneous channels of sound, while keeping the notes synchronized. It
turns out it's not that hard--provided you keep in mind the limitations
of the particular machine you're running on.

The basic technique is to start off all the channels simultaneously, and
make sure the sound channel queues never become empty thereafter. So long
as you ensure this, and calculate all your note and rest durations correctly,
you can run for quite a long time without any drift effects.

To start off the channels simultaneously, Jim Reekes' SoundApp example sends
a syncCmd to each channel with SndDoImmediate. The technique I came up with
involves sending a pauseCmd to each channel with SndDoImmediate, then queueing
up some commands in each channel with SndDoCommand, then starting them all off
by sending resumeCmd commands with SndDoImmediate. Either one seems to work
fine.

The other problem I thought about was that of accumulated drift after the
channels have been playing for some time. The good news is that the effect
is mostly insignificant, but the bad news is that when it shows up, it shows
up in a big way. That is, you don't get a slow accumulation of drift errors;
instead, things fall apart fairly suddenly.

I did some tests with the wave table synthesizer. I came up with a simple
"stress test", which involved repeatedly sounding a chord (a note on each
channel simultaneously) for half a second, alternating with silence on all
channels for half a second. I ran this test with 3 and with 4 channels, on
an LC, an SE and a IIfx. All machines were running System 7 (I know the wave
table synthesizer doesn't work on an LC running 6.0.7).

On the LC, 3 simultaneous wave table channels would stay in sync perfectly
for quite a long while. I ran the test once for about half an hour before
a perceptible delay suddenly appeared in one channel. The second time I
tried the same test, it went for over an hour and a quarter without developing
any perceptible drift, before I stopped it to keep from going batty...

Four channels didn't work so well. The LC would run for about 15 to 20
seconds before the synchronization fell apart completely--the crisp chord
would turn into a leisurely arpeggio, with the notes sounding in sequence
rather than together.

The SE was worse. Both the 3-channel and the 4-channel test fell part
within a few seconds. I haven't tried the IIfx for more than a couple of
minutes at a time, but that one works fine with both tests. I suspect the
same would be true of other models with a genuine Apple Sound Chip, rather
than the imitation in the LC and the Classic II.

The interesting thing was, I got better results playing an actual 3- or
4-part tune, where various channels would pause or rest frequently, than I
did with my stress test. The SE had no problem playing a 3-part tune, though
the 4-part one wasn't very successful. And the LC would play even the 4-part
tune without any problems, even though it goes for rather longer than the
4-channel stress test.

I then considered the problem of pulling drifting channels into sync. One
of the first things I discovered is that the syncCmd command is useless for
this purpose. In order to use it, you have to feed it to each channel with
a different value for the count, and make sure that the one with the highest
count is processed first, then the one with the next-highest count, and so on.
This is no good if you don't know which way your channels are going to drift!

The solution I came up with involved installing a special callback routine
into each channel. I would create a structure containing a list of the
channels to be synchronized, together with a count of those for which the
callback routine hasn't been called yet; then I would queue a callbackCmd
command into each of those channels, at the point in the respective command
streams that I want to be synchronized.

Each time the callback routine is entered, it decrements the count in
the common structure. If the count isn't zero, then it suspends its channel
(by sending a pauseCmd with SndDoImmediate). If the count is zero, then
it goes through the list of channels and sends each one a resumeCmd with
SndDoImmediate. Thus all the callback calls except the last one suspend
their respective channels, while the last one restarts them all.

I'm pretty sure this code works, because I can introduce intentional audible
discrepancies (both big and small) into the note timings on various channels,
and they disappear on reaching the synchronization point. Yet when I try to
use it to overcome the major synchronization problems I described above, it
makes no difference at all--on the LC, things fall apart just as quickly,
and just as badly.

This, together with the fact that the onset of loss of synchronization is
quite sudden, rather than building up gradually, leads me to conclude that
these synchronization problems are due to bugs in the Sound Manager.

If anybody wants, I can e-mail them a HyperCard stack (about 54K) in size
that they can use to investigate for themselves. It contains a set of HyperCard
externals I wrote for allocating multiple sound channels and feeding commands
to them. It also implements the callback synchronization technique in an
easy-to-use form.

Lawrence D'Oliveiro                       fone: [phone]
Computer Services Dept                     fax: [phone]
University of Waikato            electric mail: [e-mail]
Hamilton, New Zealand    37^ 47' 26" S, 175^ 19' 7" E, GMT+12:00

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (John Nagle)
Subject: Pricing of Mac vs Windows development environments
Date: 5 Jun 92 05:35:59 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)


      Apple, as we all know, just raised the price on ETO to $1250 or so.
Now, Microsoft has also made a price move.  In the other direction.
I just received an ad for Microsoft's C/C++ environment.  This
includes C,C++, windows SDK, Dialog Editor, Image Editor, Font Editor,
75,000 lines of sample code, stress testing package, Help Compiler,
CodeView debugger, and a source profiler, plus online documentation.
Some manuals, too.  (About 9" or so worth, it looks like.  A full manual
set of 4,000 pages is available separately for $150).

     The price is $139 until June 30.  That's right, only $139, about
1/10th of what Apple charges.

     Does Apple yet perceive that they might have a problem?

                    John Nagle

ps: (Microsoft is at 1-800-992-3675, ext. "NQ5").

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Paul Potts)
Organization: Instructional Technology Laboratory, University of Michigan
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 92 13:59:09 GMT

In article <#l#[e-mail]> [e-mail] (John Nagle) writes:
>
>      Apple, as we all know, just raised the price on ETO to $1250 or so.
>Now, Microsoft has also made a price move.  In the other direction.
>I just received an ad for Microsoft's C/C++ environment.  This
>includes C,C++, windows SDK, Dialog Editor, Image Editor, Font Editor,
>75,000 lines of sample code, stress testing package, Help Compiler,
>CodeView debugger, and a source profiler, plus online documentation.
>Some manuals, too.  (About 9" or so worth, it looks like.  A full manual
>set of 4,000 pages is available separately for $150).
>
>     The price is $139 until June 30.  That's right, only $139, about
>1/10th of what Apple charges.
>

No, it's not. The $139 price is the "competitive upgrade." You have to return
to Microsoft a master disk or a page from your manual for a competing product.
I purchased the Borland C++ 3.0 package (list price about $495) for $359, and
got the competitive upgrade for $139. The additional manuals (really a
necessity if you are going to do Windows programming cost $150). So, the
complete package runs around $648 to get both packages. If you want to buy
the Microsoft development system alone it is $349 from the Programmer's shop.

Yes, these packages are both good deals. However, having used both, I don't
believe they are the equivalent of ETO. The price war for Windows/DOS
development tools is becoming quite intense, and the tools are becoming
better - both C++ compilers are excellent, although I am leaning towards
the Borland C++ IDE. Maybe when there are as many Apple machines (or Power
PCs) as DOS machines out there, there will be as much competition and
price-cutting in developent environments.

By the way, these *are* PC packages: The Borland C++ IDE freezes when I try
to use my Acer mouse; the Microsoft package bombs when run under DOS using
HIMEM.SYS and EMM386, but requires 386MAX, which crashes the Borland C++ IDE;
there is a bomb when I try to run the Borland C++ IDE under Windows 3.1 using
my Logitech trackball; my Stealth VRAM video card does an incredible monitor-
blowing flicker and jig when swapping between video modes under the Microsoft
PWB... I *was* able to come up with configurations that are stable for each
product, but keep in mind these are not Macintosh programs, nor is Windows
and DOS the Mac OS. Just thought I'd mention that, because I often hear things
like "how come I can get a 16 MHz 486 machine with a 19" color monitor and
a 400 meg hard drive for $900 when a Mac Plus costs four thousand dollars?"
Don't get me wrong - I think these tools are a good deal, or I wouldn't have
bought both of them, but given my preference I would be running a fast
C++ compiler on a Mac instead. (If there was one...).

- --
The essence of OOP: "With all this horse manure, I know there's got to be
                     a pony in here somewhere!"
Paul R. Potts, Software Designer --- [e-mail] <--- me!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (John Nagle)
Date: Sun, 07 Jun 92 03:57:58 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

[e-mail] (Paul Potts) writes:

>No, it's not. The $139 price is the "competitive upgrade." You have to return
>to Microsoft a master disk or a page from your manual for a competing product.

      No, Microsoft has dropped that requirement, according to the
brochure they sent me.  This is a sale, through June 30, for $139,
plus sales tax, plus $20 "freight" (it's a big box).

      I don't know whether it's any good, but it's big and cheap.

                    John Nagle

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Paul Potts)
Organization: Instructional Technology Laboratory, University of Michigan
Date: Mon, 8 Jun 92 13:44:11 GMT

In article <dh+lyd#[e-mail]> [e-mail] (John Nagle) writes:
>[e-mail] (Paul Potts) writes:
>
>>No, it's not. The $139 price is the "competitive upgrade." You have to return
>>to Microsoft a master disk or a page from your manual for a competing product.
>
>      No, Microsoft has dropped that requirement, according to the
>brochure they sent me.  This is a sale, through June 30, for $139,
>plus sales tax, plus $20 "freight" (it's a big box).

Wow!  OK, that's cheap. You will definitely want the $150 set of additional
documentation, if you are planning on doing any Windows programming.

Anyone else who has looked at the package care to do a comparison/contrast?
- --
The essence of OOP: "With all this horse manure, I know there's got to be
                     a pony in here somewhere!"
Paul R. Potts, Software Designer --- [e-mail] <--- me!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: Adrian C Ruigrok
Organization: Bell-Northern Research
Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1992 13:54:43 GMT

In article <dh+lyd#[e-mail]> [e-mail] (John Nagle) writes:
>[e-mail] (Paul Potts) writes:
>
>>No, it's not. The $139 price is the "competitive upgrade." You have to return
>>to Microsoft a master disk or a page from your manual for a competing
product.
>
>      No, Microsoft has dropped that requirement, according to the
>brochure they sent me.  This is a sale, through June 30, for $139,
>plus sales tax, plus $20 "freight" (it's a big box).
I remain sceptical of the price...  Microsoft's only purpose in life is to make
money.

>      I don't know whether it's any good, but it's big and cheap.
>

But look what you get from Apple.
I don't know that I could argue that you are getting 10x as much, especially
since I don't have any idea what is in the Microsoft product, but with ETO you
do get a complete, very mature, application framework, 4 ~quarterly updates
(plus or minus a few months) any many other tools.  Would not Microsoft soak
you again in a few months for another $139 for yet another update?  They do it
for everything else!

Besides, $139 only buys you a lot of headaches ;-)
Adrian

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Anthony VanAlphen)
Subject: Space/CheckMark in scroll area
Date: 5 Jun 92 13:49:56 GMT
Organization: bnr

While trying to get a check mark into a scroll area we've discovered that the size
of a check is not the same size as a space! We've already tried a non-breaking space.
One alternative is a fixed width font, but the check is available only in the system
font Chicago.

Is there a trick? We *KNOW* this is possible. BTW we are using MPW C and Prototyper.
- --
Marty Sells  Phone: [phone] (home)  My opinions are my own,
[e-mail]          (613)-763-4485 (work)  not those of by employer..

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (John Purlia)
Date: 8 Jun 92 21:07:56 GMT
Organization: Qualcomm Incorporated

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Anthony VanAlphen) writes:
>
> While trying to get a check mark into a scroll area we've discovered that the size
> of a check is not the same size as a space! We've already tried a non-breaking space.
> One alternative is a fixed width font, but the check is available only in the system
> font Chicago.
>
> Is there a trick? We *KNOW* this is possible. BTW we are using MPW C and Prototyper.

Just write an LDEF that draws the check, then moves the pen to the horizontal
position at which you wish to draw the text.  Really, an LDEF is one of the
simpler defprocs to create, requvery little overhead, and allows you to truly
customize the appearance of your cell data.

- -- John Purlia
..........................................................................
John Purlia          : My brain; not my company's brain.  My brain says...
[e-mail] :      "Just about any movie could be made better
AppleLink:  AM0470   :       if one of the characters were a vampire."
..........................................................................

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Elizabeth Wylie)
Subject: Is This PostScript ?!
Date: 7 Jun 92 06:18:52 GMT
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility

Newsgroups: comp.mac.sys.programmer
Subject: Is this PostScript ?!
Summary:
Followup-To:
Distribution: world
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
Keywords:

I am trying to determine whether a particular font (given a font name and
number) has a PostScript counterpart that will be handled by ATM. I've
been told that ATM has some callback routines that would help me out,
but I don't know what these routines are.

Does anyone know of these routines or have another way of determining
whether a PS font will be drawn using PS on the screen?

Any pointers would be much appreciated.

- -Elizabeth Wylie
[e-mail]
~?

Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.programmer
Subject: Is this PostScript?!
Summary:
Followup-To:
Distribution: world
Organization: U. C. Berkeley Open Computing Facility
Keywords:

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Lloyd Lim)
Date: 8 Jun 92 16:20:56 GMT
Organization: U.C. Davis - Department of Computer Science

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Elizabeth Wylie) writes:
>
>I am trying to determine whether a particular font (given a font name and
>number) has a PostScript counterpart that will be handled by ATM. I've
>been told that ATM has some callback routines that would help me out,
>but I don't know what these routines are.
>
>Does anyone know of these routines or have another way of determining
>whether a PS font will be drawn using PS on the screen?

Yes, the procedure is named fontAvailableATM.  It's not hard but it's
a bit long to describe here.  You can call Adobe Developer Support
(415-961-4111) an ask for the second ATM tech note ("Advanced Type
Capabilities Using Adobe Type Manager on the Macintosh") and they'll
send it to you for free.  The note includes sample code.  I think you
might even be able to get a disk with C files on it.

+++
Lloyd Lim               Internet: [e-mail]
224 Lysle Leach Hall    America Online: LimUnltd
U.C. Davis              AppleLink: LimUnltd
Davis, CA  95616        CompuServe: 72647,660

---------------------------

From: montford@ukfca1 (Piran Montford)
Subject: TCL and Apple Events & aevt rsrc format
Date: 8 Jun 92 07:57:52 GMT
Organization: Schlumberger Technologies, Board Test, Ferndown, England

I'm sorry, this is a rather ill researched question, but I'm loosing my
news access soon, and I'd like this question discussed before I start my
final year project for my degree course:

What I want to know about is writing an apple-event driven program with
the TCL class library. The question is, once I get a command, should I turn
that into an apple-event, receive that, and then turn that into a CTask, or
should I generate the CTask, which then sends apple-events that I then execute?
How does this effect undoing, and the recording of apple-events?

command -> apple-event -> CTask     OR    command -> CTask -> apple-event

Any pointers, handles, or even help, would be greatefully received.

Also, could someone mail me with the aevt resource description, or even
where I could get it. Don't say develop coz I aint got it, and no 640MB of
space to unpack the stuff from apple.com.

            BCNU, Piran.

P.D.N.A.A.R.O.D.D.Montford, [e-mail], (JUST A STUDENT HERE)
Soon to be [e-mail]. Goons, Prisoner, Pooh Bear, I just love 'em.
You wanna disclaimer? Use your own. I'm being paid to do other things...

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Levent Mollamustafaoglu)
Date: 8 Jun 92 16:32:26 GMT
Organization: Aiken Computation Lab, Harvard University

In article <[e-mail]> montford@ukfca1 (Piran Montford) writes:
>I'm sorry, this is a rather ill researched question, but I'm loosing my
>news access soon, and I'd like this question discussed before I start my
>final year project for my degree course:
>
>What I want to know about is writing an apple-event driven program with
>the TCL class library. The question is, once I get a command, should I turn
>that into an apple-event, receive that, and then turn that into a CTask, or
>should I generate the CTask, which then sends apple-events that I then execute?
>How does this effect undoing, and the recording of apple-events?
>
>command -> apple-event -> CTask     OR    command -> CTask -> apple-event
>
>Any pointers, handles, or even help, would be greatefully received.
>

As far as I've seen from looking at the Apple event support in TCL,
the CSwitchboard object catches incoming Apple events and wraps them
up in a CAppleEvent object for you. The CApplication object handles
the four required Apple events for you (Open Doc etc.). If you want
to handle other Apple events, then your subclass for CApplication
should override the DOAppleEvent method to add statements for those.
Note that these other Apple events will be wrapped in CAppleEvent
objects for you. The only thing you should do is write the methods
to handle them.

As to sending Apple events, it is more complicated. TCL does not have
support (at least in a clever OOP way) for sending Apple events.
Just to give an example, you can not set the target application
anywhere in CAppleEvent, since it handles only incmoing events
(which automatically have the reply information). What you can do is
write a new type of Apple event class that handles outgoing events,
and maybe you can handle undo and other details that way.

This might be obscure, but there is as yet very little sample code
or reusable classes for wide Apple event support. (Maybe that's why
most applications only support the required Apple events and
possibly publish-subscribe :-) )


===========================================================================
Dr. Levent Mollamustafaoglu       Harvard University
[e-mail]    [e-mail]
===========================================================================

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Tng Tai Hou)
Subject: asynchronous XCMDs?
Organization: Institute of Systems Science, NUS, Singapore
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1992 09:04:57 GMT

I need to write an XCMD for SuperCard/HyperCard that is
asynchronous. In SoundEdit Pro's Fplay, which is a substitute
play command for Hypercard, it can play sound files of its own
formats and return without the sound stopping: the sound
channel is still active, as is the code resource, since
a stop command can be sent to Fplay to stop that sound.

Can someone kindly explain how this is done? How can I reference
any memory space allocated by an XCMD again? In this case, a sound
channel, which is handle to a sound resource.

Thanks.

Tai Hou
Singapore

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Waikato University)
Date: 9 Jun 92 10:31:47 +1200
Organization: University of Waikato, Hamilton, New Zealand

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Tng Tai Hou) writes:
> I need to write an XCMD for SuperCard/HyperCard that is
> asynchronous. In SoundEdit Pro's Fplay, which is a substitute
> play command for Hypercard, it can play sound files of its own
> formats and return without the sound stopping: the sound
> channel is still active, as is the code resource, since
> a stop command can be sent to Fplay to stop that sound.

There are several different ways to keep things in memory in-between
calls to a HyperCard external. One way is to use a global variable (and
hope that its name doesn't clash with anything else). Or you could load
something into the system heap and install a Gestalt selector to refer to it
(unfortunately Gestalt selectors can't point to things in the application
heap). You could poke an address into your XCMD or XFCN resource, but I
personally wouldn't trust that as a very reliable technique.

HyperCard 2.x offers another technique: create an external window ("xwindow")
and stick a pointer to your storage in its refcon field. If you make this an
invisible window, the user never has to be aware that it is there. It is even
possible to find the xwindow again on a subsequent call without having to store
a pointer to it in some other global location (e-mail me for details about
this technique). And with HyperCard 2.1, you can refer to the window by ID,
so you don't have to worry about giving it a unique name.

Lawrence D'Oliveiro                       fone: [phone]
Computer Services Dept                     fax: [phone]
University of Waikato            electric mail: [e-mail]
Hamilton, New Zealand    37^ 47' 26" S, 175^ 19' 7" E, GMT+12:00

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Paul Potts)
Date: 9 Jun 92 12:59:13 GMT
Organization: Instructional Technology Laboratory, University of Michigan

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Waikato University) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Tng Tai Hou) writes:
>> I need to write an XCMD for SuperCard/HyperCard that is
>> asynchronous. In SoundEdit Pro's Fplay, which is a substitute
>> play command for Hypercard, it can play sound files of its own
>> formats and return without the sound stopping: the sound
>> channel is still active, as is the code resource, since
>> a stop command can be sent to Fplay to stop that sound.
>
>There are several different ways to keep things in memory in-between
>calls to a HyperCard external. One way is to use a global variable (and
>hope that its name doesn't clash with anything else). Or you could load
>something into the system heap and install a Gestalt selector to refer to it
>(unfortunately Gestalt selectors can't point to things in the application
>heap). You could poke an address into your XCMD or XFCN resource, but I
>personally wouldn't trust that as a very reliable technique.
>
>HyperCard 2.x offers another technique: create an external window ("xwindow")
>and stick a pointer to your storage in its refcon field.
...

It is also possible to have your XCMD/XFCN lock itself on the heap and keep
a record of its state. This is somewhat more memory-intensive for a large
XCMD/XFCN but it is the technique that I use. I've never had any problems
with this technique except for a compatibility problem with an old RadiusWare
INIT which put a non-relocatable block right on top of Hypercard's window
data, making it non-resizable. The only caveat is that if you open a second
stack, the XCMD will be purged even though it is locked. This would probably
cause a crash if an asynch sound was playing, since the callback routine
would be wiped out. However, if your stack can prevent the user from opening
another stack it should be safe.

My XFCN is pretty robust and does thorough error-checking; I've been using
it for over a year now and don't see any hangs or crashes. I haven't
worked on it for awhile, though. I know I was experimenting with asynch sound
but I can't remember if I got it working in the XFCN. If you are interested
in "borrowing" the XFCN let me know via mail.

I know that the self-locking XFCN is probably a bad idea as far as being
friendly to other applications and to Hypercard, but it works... right now,
none of my sets of calls to the XFCN exceed the bounds of a single script
handler; that is, the XFCN never is locked for longer than it takes to
finish executing a single mouseUp handler. Supporting asynch sound changes
this some, so it will have to be tested thoroughly under these conditions.

- --
The essence of OOP: "With all this horse manure, I know there's got to be
                     a pony in here somewhere!"
Paul R. Potts, Software Designer --- [e-mail] <--- me!

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Francois Schiettecatte)
Subject: cmarker for think C 5.0
Organization: Johns Hopkins Univ. Welch Medical Library
Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1992 18:06:26 GMT

I have seen a very useful utility for think C 4.0.x called
CMarker, it puts an extra icon up on the menu bar of an
editing window and allows you to scroll down to functions
very quickly. I have not gotten it to work for think C 5.0.x.
Does anyone know how I could get it to work with 5.0.x or
is there a newer version which does.

thanks



francois


Francois Schiettecatte
Software Engineer
Welch Medical Library
Johns Hopkins University
Internet: [e-mail]
Phone    : [phone]


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Brian Hall)
Date: Sat, 06 Jun 92 20:22:20 GMT
Organization: Netcom - Online Communication Services  (408 241-9760 guest)

[e-mail] (Francois Schiettecatte) writes:

>I have seen a very useful utility for think C 4.0.x called
>CMarker, it puts an extra icon up on the menu bar of an
>editing window and allows you to scroll down to functions
>very quickly. I have not gotten it to work for think C 5.0.x.
>Does anyone know how I could get it to work with 5.0.x or
>is there a newer version which does.

I got it to "work" (see below) in Think C 5.x by installing it into 5.0
and then performing the 5.0->5.x updates.  It would not install directly
into 5.0.2.  It mostly works, but seems to have trouble with the new
C++ style comments "//".  If you avoid them, you are fine.

Another alternative I suggest you look into is PopupFuncs.  It works with
Think C 5.0 just fine, and does MPW Pascal, C, C++, and Rez as well. I
believe there is a special for users of the ShareWare BBEdit for $30,
contact the author of PUF at one of:

AOL: ESLOSSER, SLOSSER
AppleLink: D3979
[e-mail]

>From a user of both CMarker and PUF:

- --

 \ | /   | Brian Hall                 [e-mail]
 - : -   | Mark/Space Softworks       Applelink: markspace
  /|\    |                            America Online: MarkSpace
 |-+-|   |
/-\|/-\  | People don't kill people, toasters kill people.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Rich Siegel)
Date: 6 Jun 92 21:17:53 GMT
Organization: GCC Technologies

In article <f![e-mail]> [e-mail] (Brian Hall) writes:
>
>Another alternative I suggest you look into is PopupFuncs.  It works with
>Think C 5.0 just fine, and does MPW Pascal, C, C++, and Rez as well. I
>believe there is a special for users of the ShareWare BBEdit for $30,

    BBEdit isn't shareware, it's free.

    PopupFuncs and BBEdit work very well together, by design; Eric
and I collaborated on the low-level interface, so PopupFuncs doesn't require
any nasty hacking to work seamlessly with BBEdit.

R.



- --
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Rich Siegel                              Internet: [e-mail]
Software Engineer & Toolsmith
GCC Technologies

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Michel Pollet)
Organization: Groupe Axime
Date:  7 Jun 92 13:12:29 GMT

[e-mail] (Francois Schiettecatte) writes:
>I have seen a very useful utility for think C 4.0.x called
>CMarker, it puts an extra icon up on the menu bar of an
>editing window and allows you to scroll down to functions
>very quickly. I have not gotten it to work for think C 5.0.x.
>Does anyone know how I could get it to work with 5.0.x or
>is there a newer version which does.

    There a way around this : Just put the 'right' value in the
    proc id of the document window of Think C with resedit. There
    a little bug in the cmarker's installer. With this trick, I uses
    cmarker on C only (no c++) sources and it seems to work fine.
    I Think that PopupFuncs is the 'new' version of this utility. Right?

Michel


- --
- -                                 Michel Pollet                               -
- --       [e-mail] (Office), [e-mail] (Home)      --
- -               Nothing is ever accomplished by a reasonable man.            --

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Phil Shapiro)
Date: 8 Jun 92 00:35:48 GMT
Organization: Symantec Corp.

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Francois Schiettecatte) writes:

   I have seen a very useful utility for think C 4.0.x called CMarker,
   it puts an extra icon up on the menu bar of an editing window and
   allows you to scroll down to functions very quickly. I have not
   gotten it to work for think C 5.0.x.  Does anyone know how I could
   get it to work with 5.0.x or is there a newer version which does.

The newer version of CMarker is a commercial product called "CMaster".
It has the popup marker menu, along with a *ton* of other neat
features, including the ability to rebind keys, paren/bracket kissing,
auto indentation, and more.

CMaster sells for $69 (I think) through direct mail order from Jersey
Scientific, whose number I have misplaced (sorry!). Drop me an email
if you need the phone number, I can probably dig it up.

(No relation to Jersey Scientific besides satisfied customer and beta
tester.)

    -phil
- ----
   Phil Shapiro                                   Software Engineer
   Language Products Group                     Symantec Corporation
           Internet: [e-mail]
- --
   Phil Shapiro                                   Software Engineer
   Language Products Group                     Symantec Corporation
           Internet: [e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Erik A. Johnson)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana
Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1992 05:58:14 GMT

[e-mail] (Francois Schiettecatte) writes:
>   I have seen a very useful utility for think C 4.0.x called CMarker,
>   it puts an extra icon up on the menu bar of an editing window and
>   allows you to scroll down to functions very quickly. I have not
>   gotten it to work for think C 5.0.x.  Does anyone know how I could
>   get it to work with 5.0.x or is there a newer version which does.

[e-mail] (Phil Shapiro) responds:
>The newer version of CMarker is a commercial product called "CMaster".
>It has the popup marker menu, along with a *ton* of other neat
>features, including the ability to rebind keys, paren/bracket kissing,
>auto indentation, and more.

Here's a summary I posted some time ago (March?) of what CMaster does,
how much it costs, etc.  I'll repost it since there may be some interest
in it.

- -------------------------------------------------------------------------

First of all, CMaster installs (when you install the package) a couple
of resources into THINK C and modifies two others in order to patch
itself into THINK C when a project opens (including a new WDEF and a
couple of code resources).  It patches a couple of system routines
(e.g. GetNextEvent/WaitNextEvent) and a couple of THINK C routines --
all of this so that CMaster sees Events before THINK C and can modify
or handle them first.  The bulk of CMaster is stored in a file in the
System Folder, along with a prefs file, and is loaded in as necessary.

Basically, CMaster is an extension to THINK C, adding a number of
editing capabilities that are (in my opinion) quite useful to the
programmer.

When you open up a file (source or headers), you get a window that is
somewhat modified from the standard editor window.  There CMaster puts a
row of clickable icons down the left side of the window (each performs a
different function -- more on this later), the title bar is modified to have
one or more popup menus, and one menu (called, not surprisingly, "CMaster")
is added to the menuBar.

The icons along the left edge of the window perform a number of functions,
including:

  - forward/reverse searches
  - commenting/uncommenting the selected text (or, if a user-definable
    modifier key is pressed, inserting/removing #ifdef/#endif around the
    selected text)
  - multiple clipboards, each of which can be a first-in-first-out stack
    (and can be modifier-clicked to show what is in the clipboard)
  - several markers (allows you to mark a location in your code by clicking
    on the icon and return to it later by clicking in the lower half of the
    icon later -- on a mouseDown for longer than some definable number of
    ticks, this icon will show the context of the mark)
  - produce function prototypes of all of the functions within the current
    selection (or the whole file if no selection), pushing the prototypes
    onto the clipboard for pasting wherever you want
  - scroll the window until the cursor is at the {top,middle,bottom} of the
    screen OR with a modifier key, go to {top,middle,bottom} of the file
    (with command key) or the current function (with option key).

The menus that are available to be put on the window's title bar are:

  - C -- the same as the CMaster menu put in the main menubar
  - Actions -- menu equivalents to the icons
  - Markers -- a list of all of the C functions in the file, lines
               beginning with "#pragma mark", and any THINK C 5.0 marks
               (listed in the order in the file, or, with a modifier key,
               in alphabetical order); selecting one of these items jumps
               directly to that function, line or marker
  - Files -- a list of all #included files (don't need a modifier key)

The CMaster menu has several items that put up dialog windows to modify
CMasters actions, including which icons to show, which menus to use, etc.
Furthermore, CMaster has user-definable key-equivalents to all of its
functions and to some of those of THINK C and to some other functions
(e.g. forward character delete, line join, etc.).

Some other functions that I've gotten very used to having (i.e. I would
be frustrated if I had to go back to programming without them) are:

  - "Kissing" -- when you type a right {parenthesis,bracket,brace},
    CMaster briefly highlights the matching left {parenthesis,bracket,brace}
    or beeping if it cannot find the matching one (this is definable --
    you can turn off any of ')', ']', or '}', and the beeping function).
  - Window location memory using the same resource ('MPSR' # 1005) that
    MPW uses (also includes the position of the scrolling of the file and
    the current selection).  CMaster allows you to use, ignore, or
    selectively use this info.
  - CMaster includes a "SnapBack" function -- if you use the Marker menu
    or THINK C's "Find..." to go to another part of your file (such that
    the old selection point is off the screen), then the Enter key will
    SnapBack to your old insertion point.
  - "Animated Thumb" -- the thumb of the scroll-bar allows you to scan
    through the file in real-time as you drag the thumb.
  - THINK C's double-click selects an alphanumeric word.  CMaster modifies
    this so that if it is a CONTROL-double-click, it uses more of a C
    oriented definition of "word"; for example, a CONTROL-double-click on
    either "foo" or "bar" of "foo[0]->bar" would select the whole string.
  - a 'vers' editor (it assumes you use the convention of naming your
    project's resource file as projectname.rsrc) to create and modify
    both ID 0 and ID 1 'vers' version resources.


Well, this is a summary of CMaster.  On a more subjective level, I have
found it very useful, especially the prototype generator (with THINK C 5.0
having the option of requiring prototypes, it is WONDERFUL to be able to
quickly generate the prototypes of all the functions in a source file),
and the {[(-kissing feature (highlighting the matching left one, beep if
you forgot to put one in :-).  And the Markers menu is invaluable --
especially in debugging code -- it has saved me much time being able to
jump directly from one function to another without the necessity of
searching for functions in long source files.

Oh, the last price I heard was $69.95 (but that was some time ago, so
don't hold me to it).  Address, phone number, etc., for Jersey Scientific:

   Jersey Scientific, Inc.
   545 Eighth Ave., 19th Floor
   New York, NY 10018

   [phone]
   FAX: [phone]
   e-mail:   Applelink:  jersci
          Internet:  [e-mail]
        Compuserve:  70400,3361

If you send e-mail to them, include your USMail address in your e-mail so
that they can send you whatever info you need.  (Apparently it costs them
$$$ to send stuff from Applelink.)


(Standard disclaimer:  I have no connection with Jersey Scientific other than
being a satisfied CMaster customer.   And as for the AAE Dept of UIUC or the
UIUC in general ... I'm just a grad student ... they hardly know I exist. :-)


Erik A. Johnson        \    Internet: [e-mail]     \       |
- ------------------------\    AmericaOnline: ErikAJ                   \    --+--
Graduate Student         \--------------------------------------------\     |
Aero/Astro Engineering    \  "Jesus said to him, 'I am the way, and    \    |
University of Illinois at  \  the truth, and the life; no one comes to  \   |
   Urbana-Champaign (UIUC)  \  the Father except through me.'" (Jn14:6)  \

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: mike@uunet!tellab5!odgate (Mike J. Kelly)
Date: 8 Jun 92 23:52:13 GMT
Organization: Odesta Corporation

[e-mail] (Phil Shapiro) writes:

>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Francois Schiettecatte) writes:

>   I have seen a very useful utility for think C 4.0.x called CMarker,
>   it puts an extra icon up on the menu bar of an editing window and
>   allows you to scroll down to functions very quickly. I have not
>   gotten it to work for think C 5.0.x.  Does anyone know how I could
>   get it to work with 5.0.x or is there a newer version which does.

>The newer version of CMarker is a commercial product called "CMaster".
>It has the popup marker menu, along with a *ton* of other neat
>features, including the ability to rebind keys, paren/bracket kissing,
>auto indentation, and more.

>CMaster sells for $69 (I think) through direct mail order from Jersey
>Scientific, whose number I have misplaced (sorry!). Drop me an email
>if you need the phone number, I can probably dig it up.

>(No relation to Jersey Scientific besides satisfied customer and beta
>tester.)

I agree -- Cmaster is a great product, and worth supporting.  The price
is $69.95.

The number is 212-736-0406 or FAX at 212-947-4981.

- --
- --
Mike Kelly               Odesta Corporation, Northbrook, Illinois, USA
...!clout!odgate!mike    - Until odesta.com is registered.
odgate![e-mail]   - From the Internet.

---------------------------

End of C.S.M.P. Digest
**********************